Father testifies in lawsuit against Kan. church that sent pickets to son's Westminster service
Associated Press
October 25, 2007
The father of a Marine killed in Iraq took the stand yesterday in his invasion-of-privacy suit against a fundamentalist church that pickets soldiers' funerals, saying that protesters carrying signs at his son's burial made him sick to his stomach.
Albert Snyder said he had hoped for a private funeral for his son, Lance Cpl. Matthew Snyder.

"They turned this funeral into a media circus, and they wanted to hurt my family," Snyder testified. "They wanted their message heard, and they didn't care who they stepped over. My son should have been buried with dignity, not with a bunch of clowns outside."


Snyder is suing Westboro Baptist Church, whose members have picketed the funerals of military personnel killed in Iraq and Afghanistan, claiming that the deaths are punishment for the country's tolerance of homosexuality.
The York, Pa., resident is seeking unspecified monetary damages in the case for invasion of privacy and intent to inflict emotional distress as a result of the Topeka, Kan., church's protest at his son's funeral in Westminster in March last year.

The church's protests have inspired several state laws and a federal law concerning protests at funerals, but the Maryland suit is thought to be the first filed by the family of a fallen serviceman.

Asked yesterday about a sign that read "Thank God for dead soldiers," Snyder said he thinks about it daily.

"I see that sign when I lay in bed," Snyder said.

Asked about statements issued by the group that his son was raised to support the "Roman Catholic monstrosity" and then sent to fight for the "United States of Sodomy," Snyder said "they have no right to do this to people they didn't know."

During cross-examination, defense attorney Jonathan Katz focused on obituaries and death notices, and questioned Snyder about whether the family had said the funeral services were private. Snyder replied that the notices said friends and family were welcome but that he did not know all of the 500 or so people who attended.

The case tests the limits of the First Amendment right to free speech.

U.S. District Judge Richard D. Bennett instructed jurors at the start of testimony Tuesday that the First Amendment protection of free speech has limits, including vulgar, offensive and shocking statements. Bennett said the jurors must decide "whether the defendant's actions would be highly offensive to a reasonable person, whether they were extreme and outrageous, and whether these actions were so offensive and shocking as to not be entitled to First Amendment protection."

Church members said they are motivated by the fear of God and their need to warn America about its moral decay, rather than by a desire to hurt anyone.

Katz told jurors Tuesday that the protests took place 1,000 feet from St. John Roman Catholic Church, where the funeral was held and down a hill, and could not be seen or heard by those attending it.

Snyder said U.S. military personnel are in Iraq fighting for freedom of speech "not fighting for hate speech." One photo showing a child holding a sign at the funeral protest was particularly disturbing, he said.

"I pray for their children. Their children need help. To be brought up with that kind of hatred," Snyder said.

"My God is loving God," Snyder said, adding later, "I don't look for hatred in the Bible."

The church's founder and pastor, Fred Phelps, took the stand after Snyder and prompted a strong admonition from Bennett when the pastor said he had not considered whether children would see a sign carried by protesters with the words "Semper Fi Fags" and two stick figures that appeared to be engaged in sodomy.

"No, it's an irrelevancy," Phelps said.

"Just answer the question, sir. Don't determine what's relevant or not relevant. You just answer the question," Bennett said.

I would have ****ed them up and then got away.If it wasn't for soldiers those phony christians would not even have a church.I would not have drawn blood though.The story is a piss off.

whats wrong with these people who would violate a funeral for the sake of thier politics?

One possibility;

The church has about 60 members, most of them related to its founder, the Rev. Fred Phelps.

Not enough genes in the gene pool!!

Not funny, I know

The other possibility which I base on this statement in the NY Times;

The Westboro protesters, whose church is in Topeka, Kan., frequently picket the funerals of military officials and soldiers killed in Iraq and Afghanistan because church leaders assert that God is killing soldiers to punish America for condoning homosexuality.

This is similar to what many groups do. Although extreme and tasteless, it is no different than the GBLT taking on the boyscouts, blacks in Jenna, La, protesting a quilty boy, or Move-on.org spreading half-truths on the internet and slandering General Petreaous name all in the name of their particular cause.

Its unethical, immorral, and shows spite. None of these things should be brought into an intelligent debate!

We used to call it dirty pool and relied on individuals to check their own conscience, but hey, "These are different times."

Like Michaelblade, I would have ****ed them up, only I wouldnt have tried to get away! I would have stayed and kept ****ing them up till either one of them dropped me or the cops arrived.

People in America these days have a win at all cost anything goes attitude. What happened to winning with honor?

Fanta writes:

"This is similar to what many groups do. Although extreme and tasteless, it is no different than the GBLT taking on the boyscouts, blacks in Jenna, La, protesting a quilty boy, or Move-on.org spreading half-truths on the internet and slandering General Petreaous name all in the name of their particular cause.

Its unethical, immorral, and shows spite. None of these things should be brought into an intelligent debate!"

Well Fanta, it's obvious you're puked out by GLBTs, but to compare them to the publishers of the website www.godhatesfags.com is waaay over the top. You might as well compare them to the Nazis while you're at it and be done with it.

In case you missed it, the Westboro Baptist Church picketed Matthew Shepard's funeral as well as the trial of his assailants. They carried signs that said things like "Matt Shepard Rots in Hell". On their website they used to have an animated .gif of Shepard surrounded by flames with screams in the background.

From Wikipedia:

"When the Wyoming Supreme Court ruled that it was legal to display any sort of religious message on city property if it was legal for Casper's Ten Commandments display to remain, Phelps made attempts to gain city permits in Cheyenne and Casper to build a monument "of marble or granite 5 or 6 feet in height on which will be a bronze plaque bearing Shepard's picture and the words: "MATTHEW SHEPARD, Entered Hell October 12, 1998, in Defiance of God's Warning: 'Thou shalt not lie with mankind as with womankind; it is abomination.' Leviticus 18:22.

As a counter protest during Henderson's trial, Romaine Patterson, a friend of Shepard's, organized a group of individuals who assembled in a circle around the Phelps group wearing white robes and gigantic wings (resembling angels) that blocked the protesters. Police had to create a human barrier between the 2 protest groups. While the organization had no name in the initial demonstration, it has since been ascribed various titles, including 'Angels of Peace' and 'Angel Action'.

In the years following Shepard's death, his mother Judy has become a well-known advocate for LGBT rights, particularly issues relating to gay youth. She is a prime force behind the Matthew Shepard Foundation, which supports diversity and tolerance in youth organizations."

Do you want to say that what she is doing is immoral?

Your tactics are no different from those of the Far Right neocons wrapping their cause in the flag and then accusing people of treason for being against the war in Iraq. I'd think you might want to recant, because IMO, there's no basis whatsoever for comparison between the two groups and their political actions.

-Kerry O.

I agree with KerryO. We should be cautious when comparing people with these fools - I read about them a while back on an atheist website. They are extremist by the standards of extremists.

Kerry-o, you just wasted a whole lot of words. I know nothing about the trial you seem so concerned with. It was mentioned in the article that I recall. It was about protesting at a soldiers funeral, which like I said I find appalling.

My comparison in this regard stands. The GBLT and Moveon.org will do anything to get attention, including lying and destroying good things in the process.

You can twist my words however you wish. All you do is prove what I said. You cant see far enough past the end of your own nose to see the spite that GBLT is run by!

Im sorry for that and nothing else. By the way, I have addressed the topic up till now and not you massage or any other member. How about you do the same. If your able to get past your insecurity and spite!!

"It wasnt mentioned"

Fanta,

I'm sorry, I just don't see it. These people are LOCO, man! Yes, people in these other movements have their reality filters and their spite, I actually agree with you on that! Emphatically! But when you said "although extreme and tasteless, it is no different than the GBLT taking on the boyscouts..." I have to wonder how familiar you are with this group. These people are just OUT THERE. KerryO's nazi comment echoed my own thoughts when I read your words. I'm not defending move-on or any other groups (as an animal lover and rights asvocate, Peta is my nemesis), I just think your comparison was unfair, and suspect you might not be familiar with these wing-nuts.

Fanta, in response to your last paragraph, if we think someone has said something unfair or inaccurate, should we not address them and what they said? I do not mean any of this as personally against you, just a comparison you made a few posts back.

Fanta,

I stand by the argument that GLBT organizations are not anything like the Phelps family. You've had your opportunity to refute my argument, and IMO, it still dosn't pass the smell test. Your use of ad hominem attacks and character assassination did nothing to improve its aroma.

If you want to do your best to marginalize people as second class citizens rightfully excluded because of religious tests, go for it. It's my opinion that that flies counter to the Establishment Clause of the Constitution and they shouldn't be able to promulgate these ideas using public largesse. Such a stance is hardly tantamount to destroying the organization.

Apparently an increasing number of citizens, donors and charitable associations agree, most of which have no ties whatsoever to the All Powerful GLBT lobby's brainwashing of all but the Right Kind of Citizens.

They all can't be followers of the Rev. Fred Phelps. I suggest you measure their noses too, and get back to us.


-Kerry O.

Thats very sad that they would disrespect someone in that way, nobody should do that especially at a funeral. God bless the soldiers that go over there for the war and their families that have to deal with that grief.

there is a difference between religious freedom and free speech

neither of which should be restricted

but when accusations and judgments of others are made

then they should be held accountable for their actions

and be removed and have to pay the consequence

judge not lest ye be judged

i wonder what will be brought up if they see a maker

insert head scratching emoticon here

did anyone see the vid on youtube of the Freedom Riders went to a funeral the Phelps family was protesting at?needless to say the Phelps family couldn't be seen or heard because the Freedom Riders

You know whether you agree with the war or disagree, this is a horrible horrible thing to do to a grieving family.

Aren't these the Phelps family, the inbred so called "christian" who protest at soldiers' funerals?

These people need professional psychological help.

I agree with Timoreck. We had a funeral for a soldier recently in my hometown that was almost TRASHED by some christian biker group "rallying for their cause". RALLYING? What about that family who lost their son? I say I hope this family wins this lawsuit. Simply a funeral is for closure for the family. Its that simple.