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Topic: Israel to launch 75 thousand troops ground offensive.
no photo
Tue 11/20/12 09:02 AM

Without Israeli-American strategic cooperation the world would be a much more dangerous place.... Israel helps keep America safe, the aid we send to them is one h*ll of a bargain....


Leigh! flowerforyou I respectfully disagree with this, It is Israeli-American military cooperation and blind support that has put us ALL in danger for the last 20 years, prior to 9/11 even. Your economy continues to suffer because of it, innocence continues to be the largest victim and true rogue countries are taking hold through democratic means? It's a mess... Let's treat it as such.


From Bloomberg:

quote: This most recent outbreak of violence represents the opening round of the third Palestinian intifada. The first intifada, which began in 1987 and petered out in the early 1990s, was an uprising of stones and Molotov cocktails. The second intifada, which began 12 years ago, was an uprising of suicide bombers. The third uprising, inevitably, was going to feature rockets and missiles. I don’t care to think about what sorts of weapons and tactics will feature in the fourth intifada.


Peace!


Thank you for always being a gentleman John, it's very provocativebigsmile Are you saying American-Israeli military cooperation is responsible for our economic crisis?.....noway

"Canada remains a relatively small player in world affairs, but Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's visit to Ottawa on March 2 reflects the growing significance of Canada's relationship with Israel, which in recent years has deepened — both politically and economically."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/03/01/f-canada-israel-relations.html

no photo
Tue 11/20/12 09:41 AM
Edited by Jeanniebean on Tue 11/20/12 09:48 AM


Some facts about American aid and political support to Israel....

The financial reciprocity the US receives from aid to Israel is unmatched by any and all aid we provide to other countries.... Much of the money that the US gives Israel is used by Israel to purchase military and civilian goods and services from us meaning American aid to Israel is recycled back into our economy. Nearly 90% of US aid to Israel is military and Israel spends about 75% of that buying US goods...Israel leads the world in collecting intelligence on terrorist groups, intelligence which it provides to the US....Israeli and American intelligence agencies continuously exchange information, analyses, and operational experience in counter-terrorism and counter-proliferation...Israel’s enemies are America’s enemies, they fight the same Islamo-fascist terrorism that brought down our World Trade Center, blew up a large chunk of the Pentagon, killed more than 3,000 innocent American civilians, and cost our economy billions of dollars... Without Israeli-American strategic cooperation the world would be a much more dangerous place.... Israel helps keep America safe, the aid we send to them is one h*ll of a bargain....




I'm not so sure of that claim that "Islamo-fascist terrorist" are the ones responsible for bringing down the World trade center. A large percent of the population agree.

I don't think they are smart enough to infiltrate our country and pull off that kind of operation. Especially seeing what they are doing right now with their puny little rockets demanding that their terms are met. They have got to be very ignorant.

And yet you want people to believe they pulled off the attack on the world trade center against the most powerful country in the world.

Gullible.


Israel’s enemies are America’s enemies,



I don't think I am going to let anyone tell me who my 'enemy' is supposed to be. Least of all Israel.






no photo
Tue 11/20/12 10:06 AM


Without Israeli-American strategic cooperation the world would be a much more dangerous place.... Israel helps keep America safe, the aid we send to them is one h*ll of a bargain....


Leigh! flowerforyou I respectfully disagree with this, It is Israeli-American military cooperation and blind support that has put us ALL in danger for the last 20 years, prior to 9/11 even. Your economy continues to suffer because of it, innocence continues to be the largest victim and true rogue countries are taking hold through democratic means? It's a mess... Let's treat it as such.


From Bloomberg:

quote: This most recent outbreak of violence represents the opening round of the third Palestinian intifada. The first intifada, which began in 1987 and petered out in the early 1990s, was an uprising of stones and Molotov cocktails. The second intifada, which began 12 years ago, was an uprising of suicide bombers. The third uprising, inevitably, was going to feature rockets and missiles. I don’t care to think about what sorts of weapons and tactics will feature in the fourth intifada.


Peace!


Thank you for always being a gentleman John, it's very provocativebigsmile Are you saying American-Israeli military cooperation is responsible for our economic crisis?.....noway

"Canada remains a relatively small player in world affairs, but Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's visit to Ottawa on March 2 reflects the growing significance of Canada's relationship with Israel, which in recent years has deepened — both politically and economically."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/03/01/f-canada-israel-relations.html


Are you saying American-Israeli military cooperation is responsible for our economic crisis?


Indirectly yes! Decades of war will do this, just ask the Russians. Only if you subscribe to the:

-Decades of Blind Israel military support bone
connected to...
-The Embassy bombings, USS Cole bombing and Al Qaeda bone
connected to...
-More Israeli support bone
connected to...
-9/11 bone
connected to...
-The Afghan and Iraqi decade war bone.
connected to...
-More Israeli support

There you are, The "In the chitter" recipe!
This was Osama Bin Crabfood's plan all along.
Americans scoffed at the idea back then and still do by the looks of things.


PS: The majority of Canadians want nothing to do with cozzying to the Israelis... Most feel any cooperation with Israel on any level takes us away from our PEACEKEEPING past and exposed to the grim reality of a useless war.sick


no photo
Tue 11/20/12 10:49 AM



Are you saying American-Israeli military cooperation is responsible for our economic crisis?


Indirectly yes! Decades of war will do this, just ask the Russians. Only if you subscribe to the:

-Decades of Blind Israel military support bone
connected to...
-The Embassy bombings, USS Cole bombing and Al Qaeda bone
connected to...
-More Israeli support bone
connected to...
-9/11 bone
connected to...
-The Afghan and Iraqi decade war bone.
connected to...
-More Israeli support

There you are, The "In the chitter" recipe!
This was Osama Bin Crabfood's plan all along.
Americans scoffed at the idea back then and still do by the looks of things.


PS: The majority of Canadians want nothing to do with cozzying to the Israelis... Most feel any cooperation with Israel on any level takes us away from our PEACEKEEPING past and exposed to the grim reality of a useless war.sick


A real bone of contention laugh

PS: Didn't Harper win the popular vote by a pretty big majority in '06?


no photo
Tue 11/20/12 11:42 AM
PS: Didn't Harper win the popular vote by a pretty big majority in '06?


Harper Minority government in 2006
36.3% of votes... By proportion of seats, this was Canada's smallest minority government since Confederation.


He is out next elections... I guarantee it!!! smokin Canada=Peace!


Peace!

no photo
Tue 11/20/12 12:04 PM

PS: Didn't Harper win the popular vote by a pretty big majority in '06?


Harper Minority government in 2006
36.3% of votes... By proportion of seats, this was Canada's smallest minority government since Confederation.


He is out next elections... I guarantee it!!! smokin Canada=Peace!


Peace!



Still, he does support Israel in a big way and he did win the popular vote...Maybe it was due to the "Adscam" Liberal corruption scandal??

no photo
Tue 11/20/12 12:52 PM


PS: Didn't Harper win the popular vote by a pretty big majority in '06?


Harper Minority government in 2006
36.3% of votes... By proportion of seats, this was Canada's smallest minority government since Confederation.


He is out next elections... I guarantee it!!! smokin Canada=Peace!


Peace!



Still, he does support Israel in a big way and he did win the popular vote...Maybe it was due to the "Adscam" Liberal corruption scandal??


Naw... I'd attribute it more to voting for him or... the yard ape and porch monkey he was running against?... And funny enough, he never included Israel in his election platform... Hmmm

no photo
Tue 11/20/12 01:00 PM



PS: Didn't Harper win the popular vote by a pretty big majority in '06?


Harper Minority government in 2006
36.3% of votes... By proportion of seats, this was Canada's smallest minority government since Confederation.


He is out next elections... I guarantee it!!! smokin Canada=Peace!


Peace!



Still, he does support Israel in a big way and he did win the popular vote...Maybe it was due to the "Adscam" Liberal corruption scandal??


Naw... I'd attribute it more to voting for him or... the yard ape and porch monkey he was running against?... And funny enough, he never included Israel in his election platform... Hmmm


I need to "bone" up on your election process:tongue: ....Wasn't Harper re-elected?...Surely you Canadian folks knew where he stood the second time around....

HotRodDeluxe's photo
Tue 11/20/12 02:15 PM
A Potential Cease-Fire and the New Regional Dynamic

November 20, 2012 | 1603 GMT


Summary

The proliferation of players in the current Israeli-Hamas cease-fire negotiations highlight the major shift in the regional strategic environment since the fall of former Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak, calling into question the sustainability of any potential truce.

Analysis

U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton will be in Israel overnight Nov. 20 and rumors are rapidly spreading of an imminent cease-fire agreement. Egyptian President Mohammed Morsi has also confidently claimed Nov. 20 that "the war will end today," but statements out of Israel have been far more reserved. The Times of Israel, citing Egyptian intelligence officials, reported that Israel has rejected the cease-fire draft and that there will no news conference announcing a cease-fire tonight.

The core dilemma remains: If Hamas or any other Palestinian entity can threaten Israel's major population centers with long-range Fajr-5 rockets, what guarantees can Egypt or another third party make to neutralize that supply and prevent further shipments? The fact that another Fajr-5 rocket was fired at Jerusalem on Nov. 20 while thousands of Israeli troops remain forward-deployed in preparation for a ground invasion adds urgency to this question.

Stratfor has learned that the Egyptian cease-fire proposal that Clinton will be studying with the Israelis entails an agreement by the major Palestinian factions to cease rocket attacks against Israel. In return, Egypt would send monitors to Gaza to enforce the cease-fire -- though no details were provided on whether Egypt would secure or remove the remaining rockets from Gaza and what Egypt would do to prevent replenishments from entering Gaza if the border is reopened. Israel would discontinue its policy of targeted killings and, at a later stage, would allow the opening of the Rafah crossing on a regular basis. Rumors continue to percolate on the terms of the cease-fire proposal, and the above claims could not be verified, but these terms do fit with the likely parameters of the negotiation.

The problem is that Israel does not trust the Muslim Brotherhood-led government to enforce the cease-fire agreement. As a result, the United States is taking a more active role in the negotiation. Egyptian diplomatic sources are claiming that the Palestinian Fajr-5 rocket arsenal is dwindling, but will the United States play a role in verifying the Egyptian figures and removing the rockets from Gaza? What role, if any, will the United States play in monitoring the Sinai-Gaza border for future weapons shipments? That much remains unclear. The role of Egyptian intelligence and military figures from the Mubarak era is critical in these negotiations. Though the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood has been in the diplomatic spotlight, there are indications that Egyptian intelligence chief Mohamed Raafat Shehata has been heavily involved in the negotiations with Hamas, Palestinian Islamic Jihad and Israel behind the scenes. Shehata is reportedly delivering a news conference this evening, at which point a truce may be announced.

There is also another layer of complexity to factor in. Hamas is not the sole representative of the Palestinians in Cairo. Egyptian mediators have been negotiating with Hamas and the Palestinian Islamic Jihad. The latter, which has much closer links to Iran (which likely has an interest in prolonging the conflict), has claimed responsibility for firing several Fajr-5 rockets and is allegedly part of a joint military command with Hamas that is controlling the long-range rocket attacks.

Stratfor sources in Egypt, Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad have separately claimed that Palestinian Islamic Jihad is in control of at least some of the Iranian-made Fajr-5 rockets and launchers. If this is true, and Palestinian Islamic Jihad is not simply serving as a convenient front for Hamas, then Hamas' commitment to a cease-fire must involve Palestinian Islamic Jihad. To this end, Palestinian Islamic Jihad chief Ramadan Abdullah Mohammed Shallah has been in Cairo for negotiations over a cease-fire and has been dealing with both Hamas and Egypt. An Egyptian source claims that Morsi has held frequent meetings with Shallah in trying to obtain guarantees on a cessation of rocket attacks. For now, it appears those talks are bearing fruit and Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad are on the same page in moving toward a cease-fire. The questions now are whether Israel feels a ground operation is still necessary and whether it has exhausted the diplomatic negotiations to move ahead.

Gone are the days when Egyptian intelligence could mediate a truce between Israel and Hamas alone. The shifting dynamics over the past year -- from the rise of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt to Hamas' decision to publicly distance itself from Iran and position itself in the Muslim Brotherhood orbit while receiving Iranian weapons transfers, to Iran's attempts to maintain leverage in the Levant through groups such as the Palestinian Islamic Jihad -- seem to be greatly complicating an already trying negotiation effort.


Conrad_73's photo
Tue 11/20/12 02:31 PM

A Potential Cease-Fire and the New Regional Dynamic

November 20, 2012 | 1603 GMT


Summary

The proliferation of players in the current Israeli-Hamas cease-fire negotiations highlight the major shift in the regional strategic environment since the fall of former Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak, calling into question the sustainability of any potential truce.

Analysis

U.S. Secretary of State Hillary Clinton will be in Israel overnight Nov. 20 and rumors are rapidly spreading of an imminent cease-fire agreement. Egyptian President Mohammed Morsi has also confidently claimed Nov. 20 that "the war will end today," but statements out of Israel have been far more reserved. The Times of Israel, citing Egyptian intelligence officials, reported that Israel has rejected the cease-fire draft and that there will no news conference announcing a cease-fire tonight.

The core dilemma remains: If Hamas or any other Palestinian entity can threaten Israel's major population centers with long-range Fajr-5 rockets, what guarantees can Egypt or another third party make to neutralize that supply and prevent further shipments? The fact that another Fajr-5 rocket was fired at Jerusalem on Nov. 20 while thousands of Israeli troops remain forward-deployed in preparation for a ground invasion adds urgency to this question.

Stratfor has learned that the Egyptian cease-fire proposal that Clinton will be studying with the Israelis entails an agreement by the major Palestinian factions to cease rocket attacks against Israel. In return, Egypt would send monitors to Gaza to enforce the cease-fire -- though no details were provided on whether Egypt would secure or remove the remaining rockets from Gaza and what Egypt would do to prevent replenishments from entering Gaza if the border is reopened. Israel would discontinue its policy of targeted killings and, at a later stage, would allow the opening of the Rafah crossing on a regular basis. Rumors continue to percolate on the terms of the cease-fire proposal, and the above claims could not be verified, but these terms do fit with the likely parameters of the negotiation.

The problem is that Israel does not trust the Muslim Brotherhood-led government to enforce the cease-fire agreement. As a result, the United States is taking a more active role in the negotiation. Egyptian diplomatic sources are claiming that the Palestinian Fajr-5 rocket arsenal is dwindling, but will the United States play a role in verifying the Egyptian figures and removing the rockets from Gaza? What role, if any, will the United States play in monitoring the Sinai-Gaza border for future weapons shipments? That much remains unclear. The role of Egyptian intelligence and military figures from the Mubarak era is critical in these negotiations. Though the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood has been in the diplomatic spotlight, there are indications that Egyptian intelligence chief Mohamed Raafat Shehata has been heavily involved in the negotiations with Hamas, Palestinian Islamic Jihad and Israel behind the scenes. Shehata is reportedly delivering a news conference this evening, at which point a truce may be announced.

There is also another layer of complexity to factor in. Hamas is not the sole representative of the Palestinians in Cairo. Egyptian mediators have been negotiating with Hamas and the Palestinian Islamic Jihad. The latter, which has much closer links to Iran (which likely has an interest in prolonging the conflict), has claimed responsibility for firing several Fajr-5 rockets and is allegedly part of a joint military command with Hamas that is controlling the long-range rocket attacks.

Stratfor sources in Egypt, Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad have separately claimed that Palestinian Islamic Jihad is in control of at least some of the Iranian-made Fajr-5 rockets and launchers. If this is true, and Palestinian Islamic Jihad is not simply serving as a convenient front for Hamas, then Hamas' commitment to a cease-fire must involve Palestinian Islamic Jihad. To this end, Palestinian Islamic Jihad chief Ramadan Abdullah Mohammed Shallah has been in Cairo for negotiations over a cease-fire and has been dealing with both Hamas and Egypt. An Egyptian source claims that Morsi has held frequent meetings with Shallah in trying to obtain guarantees on a cessation of rocket attacks. For now, it appears those talks are bearing fruit and Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad are on the same page in moving toward a cease-fire. The questions now are whether Israel feels a ground operation is still necessary and whether it has exhausted the diplomatic negotiations to move ahead.

Gone are the days when Egyptian intelligence could mediate a truce between Israel and Hamas alone. The shifting dynamics over the past year -- from the rise of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt to Hamas' decision to publicly distance itself from Iran and position itself in the Muslim Brotherhood orbit while receiving Iranian weapons transfers, to Iran's attempts to maintain leverage in the Levant through groups such as the Palestinian Islamic Jihad -- seem to be greatly complicating an already trying negotiation effort.


Gonna be interesting when one of those Rockets hits a Muslim Holy Site in Jerusalem!noway

metalwing's photo
Tue 11/20/12 02:34 PM
Edited by metalwing on Tue 11/20/12 03:31 PM
I think it is a real shame that Israel has been getting more and more "politically correct" bending to the will of the media and the UN instead of just doing what is right. Their primary obligation should be to protect their people. If that means going into Gaza and cleaning their clock to the point of making it clear that firing rockets at civilians is a VERY BAD IDEA, so be it. That is what I would expect the US to do, but the human casualties from the border drug cartels are actually worse and little is being done about it.

HotRodDeluxe's photo
Tue 11/20/12 02:44 PM

I think it is a real shame that Israel has been getting more and more "politically correct" bending to the will of the media and the UN instead of just doing what is right. Their primary obligation should be to protect their people. If that means going into Gaza and cleaning their clock to the point of making it clear that firing rockets at civilians is a VERY BAD IDEA, so be it. That is what I would expect the US to do, but the human casualties from the border drugs cartels are actually worse and little is being done about it.


Another cease-fire which will be broken on the Palestinian side, as usual, and the cycle will continue.

HotRodDeluxe's photo
Tue 11/20/12 02:49 PM

laugh 75'000 to attack Gaza?rofl rofl rofl rofl

Soooooome Logistics!:laughing:


Less than half is more realistic.laugh

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