Topic: 9-9-9? Not so good as some might think!
Sojourning_Soul's photo
Thu 10/13/11 06:15 AM
Cain now actually leads the field in some new polls. One seems like a dodgy poll, in that it shows Newt Gingrich at 15 percent, which I doubt is accurate even among his extended family. But another is Wall Street Journal/NBC. There’s no denying—Cain is riding the wave. He’s a nice feel-good candidate, an indulgence, an escape hatch from the disappointment of Rick Perry and the tedious (seeming) inevitably of Mitt Romney—and finally, a way for Tea Partiers to say, “See? We’re not racists!” In all those senses he has a lot going for him. But now his plan has started to face serious scrutiny, and that scrutiny is revealing that it’s undoubtedly the most radical shift of wealth that a presidential candidate has proposed in this country since (speaking of communists) Gus Hall.

Bruce Bartlett, the esteemed economist who is an apostate conservative but also not a liberal, recently sliced the plan to pieces. “A distributional monstrosity,” Bartlett wrote, under which “the poor would pay more while the rich would have their taxes cut, with no guarantee that economic growth will increase and good reason to believe that the budget deficit will increase.” We’ll get to a few details on that in a moment.

But what’s really startling about Bartlett’s report—and this is what got me thinking about Comrade Ulyanov—is that the 9-9-9 plan is not his goal. No—it’s merely Phase 2 in the melting away of the state! Phase 1 would reduce business and personal income taxes to a high rate of 25 percent. That sounds nice. But you have to know about concepts like marginalization to realize that 96 percent of all taxpayers don’t even make enough to pay a single dollar in income taxes at rates above 25 percent. So in other words, Cain cuts taxes—for the top 4 percent. And for the top 1 percent—especially the top 0.2 percent (millionaires)—he cuts them radically.

The same applies to Cain’s proposals for business taxes. Cain’s Phase 1, the way it’s structured, would cut taxes mostly for the largest corporations and not help small- and medium-size concerns that are 92 percent of businesses. And he’d abolish all taxes on capital gains. Two-thirds of all capital gains are reported by taxpayers with yearly incomes above $1 million.

Getting the picture? A massive Christmas gift for the well-off. And remember—that’s just Phase 1! The 9-9-9 plan is Phase 2, calling for a 9 percent rate for business taxes, personal income taxes, and a national sales tax. First of all, the numbers don’t add up. Either government services will be savaged or we’ll run an unthinkable deficit. And again, middle- and lower-income people will be crushed, even worse than under Phase 1. Most poor and many working-class people pay no income tax (they do, of course, pay payroll taxes). But under Cain’s plan, they would pay. And the wealthy would pay far, far, far less than they do now. Far, far, far less than George W. Bush ever dreamed of making them pay.

Cain would say: But I get rid of payroll taxes. Fine. That saves an average taxpayer about $3,000. But it also means there is no Social Security, since that is how Social Security is financed. So the taxpayer would probably plow most of that back into a private retirement account anyway. Then, she pays a 9 percent tax on everything she buys. What people buy, from food to entertainment to what have you, usually amounts to 60 percent or more of their income.

Ah, but if you think that’s a lot of sales tax, just wait till you hear about Phase 3. This last phase ends 9-9-9 and imposes a (get this name) “Fair Tax”—a 30 percent sales tax on all goods and services. The theory here is that prices will fall. Another part of the theory, which proponents don’t mention quite as often, is that wages would fall, too. And all that’s on top of spending $130 for a $100 pair of sneakers for your teenager, or $780 for a $600 television.

It’s no wonder that Cain’s chief economist, Rich Lowrie, isn’t even an economist but a “wealth management” consultant. The Cain plan is entirely about wealth management. And GOP primary voters love them some wealth management. This plan will surely help Cain in primary season.

So I do have to hand it to him. He understands the spirit of the age in some way. Be as radical and simplistic and unrealistic as possible, and lustily feed the haves’ hatred of the have nots. And be black while doing it—better still! And feed America pizza too! It’s a good thing for the world Lenin was never quite this clever.


InvictusV's photo
Thu 10/13/11 07:42 AM
Bruce Bartlett wrote a great book titled "Wrong on Race: The Democratic Party’s Buried Past"


It shines the light on who the real racists were and still are..




Cain's tax plan is odd, but the status quo is unacceptable.

Chazster's photo
Thu 10/13/11 08:21 AM
Pretty sure he doesn't count for food.

"Cain is a strong supporter of the FairTax,[11] which would replace all federal personal and corporate income taxes with a 23% national sales tax on all new goods and services, with a "prebate" to untax goods and services deemed necessary by the Department of Health and Human Services"

Are you saying they wouldn't consider food necessary? It sounds to me that they would tax your spending money. Food and shelter would't be taxed. Probably medical stuff too.

boredinaz06's photo
Thu 10/13/11 08:43 AM



Cain was explaining his 9-9-9 plan on some news program and while I'm listening to it I felt myself wanting to call him Herman Romney. This plan benefits big business and nothing else.

Chazster's photo
Thu 10/13/11 09:16 AM




Cain was explaining his 9-9-9 plan on some news program and while I'm listening to it I felt myself wanting to call him Herman Romney. This plan benefits big business and nothing else.

Lol totally untrue. I was paying over 23% taxes when I was working plus about 9% sales tax. So if I just started paying 13% more sales tax but paying 0 income I would have saved so much more money. Not to mention I am not taxed on what I don't spend. Also then they only tax your money once. Supposedly its illegal to tax the same money twice but they do it all the time now.

boredinaz06's photo
Thu 10/13/11 09:24 AM





Cain was explaining his 9-9-9 plan on some news program and while I'm listening to it I felt myself wanting to call him Herman Romney. This plan benefits big business and nothing else.

Lol totally untrue. I was paying over 23% taxes when I was working plus about 9% sales tax. So if I just started paying 13% more sales tax but paying 0 income I would have saved so much more money. Not to mention I am not taxed on what I don't spend. Also then they only tax your money once. Supposedly its illegal to tax the same money twice but they do it all the time now.


Cain first and foremost is a business man, if it is not a huge benefit for business he wouldn't be talking about it.

Sojourning_Soul's photo
Thu 10/13/11 09:31 AM
In my own opinion...... (as I can only speak for myself)
Republicrats and the 2 party system, funded by Big Banks and Big Business (part of the reason for OWS), have been too long the deciding oligarchy of our nation and it's Republic. It turns my stomach to watch the debates and listen to the hype, knowing we are in for "more of the same" with the media sponsored, opinionated bias, and sell-out of the major networks (just more Big Business).
Obama is the perfect example of the hype. We wanted change, he gave it to us, by selling out America to the bankers (just read the resumes of his entire staff..... all Wall Streeters and bankers, the same people who gave us this mess!). He has accellerated our decline, and changed nothing but allow more power to the banks. Now he has taken a traitoristic office for the UN, which is strictly against the Constitution for any president to do. Worse than the puppet Bush, Obama has disregarded his obligations under the Constitution at every turn!
Romney, Santorum, Perry, Cain...... and a similar list on the "other" party side,........... you know the list........ all Millionaires! Lawyers, politicians, business owners and CEO's! How can we expect ANY of them to act on our behalf? The results? MORE OF THE SAME!
There is but ONE candidate who has NOT changed his views for public opinion, cares about personal liberties and freedom, and predicted as well as tried to prevent, for over 20 years, the events of today.... RON PAUL!
He does not subscribe to the lucretive retirement plan Congress voted for itself, he has constantly voted for disclosure, audit or abolishment of the Federal Reserve (a private banking cartel), and their power over the people by their enforcers.... the IRS! This is just to name a few of his many honorable traits. I don't agree with all his opinions or beliefs, but he is the only one who stands behind my right to feel that way!!!! A man of morals and integrity, who knows when the harddrive fails in your computer, you replace it, not drive yourself crazy spending needless time and hundreds (in this case TRILLIONS) of dollars trying to fix it!
He is against "Undeclared War" and for a strong "National Defense".... two horses of a different color! This (the war machine), and the amount of profits to large private corporations and Wall Street, has cause the mess we are in today. Wall Street and the bankers buying our leaders to keep the wars going. All the while the Central Banks keep printing more and more fiat currency, of no value, and laying the burden of the cost on the people, while they enjoy the fruits of vast profits, feeding the perpetual circle, until they hyper inflate the currency of our nation, causing the loss of our sovernty and our republic!
The list of wrongs, of criminal acts, and debauchery in government goes on and on!
IT IS TIME FOR CHANGE!
KNOW YOUR CANDIDATE, BEFORE YOU VOTE IN "MORE OF THE SAME" OR "THE LESSER OF TWO EVILS"!
RESTORE OUR REPUBLIC! POWER TO THE PEOPLE!
Again, this is jmo, with faith in all of us to do the right thing come election day, or before if needed.

Seakolony's photo
Thu 10/13/11 10:18 AM

In my own opinion...... (as I can only speak for myself)
Republicrats and the 2 party system, funded by Big Banks and Big Business (part of the reason for OWS), have been too long the deciding oligarchy of our nation and it's Republic. It turns my stomach to watch the debates and listen to the hype, knowing we are in for "more of the same" with the media sponsored, opinionated bias, and sell-out of the major networks (just more Big Business).
Obama is the perfect example of the hype. We wanted change, he gave it to us, by selling out America to the bankers (just read the resumes of his entire staff..... all Wall Streeters and bankers, the same people who gave us this mess!). He has accellerated our decline, and changed nothing but allow more power to the banks. Now he has taken a traitoristic office for the UN, which is strictly against the Constitution for any president to do. Worse than the puppet Bush, Obama has disregarded his obligations under the Constitution at every turn!
Romney, Santorum, Perry, Cain...... and a similar list on the "other" party side,........... you know the list........ all Millionaires! Lawyers, politicians, business owners and CEO's! How can we expect ANY of them to act on our behalf? The results? MORE OF THE SAME!
There is but ONE candidate who has NOT changed his views for public opinion, cares about personal liberties and freedom, and predicted as well as tried to prevent, for over 20 years, the events of today.... RON PAUL!
He does not subscribe to the lucretive retirement plan Congress voted for itself, he has constantly voted for disclosure, audit or abolishment of the Federal Reserve (a private banking cartel), and their power over the people by their enforcers.... the IRS! This is just to name a few of his many honorable traits. I don't agree with all his opinions or beliefs, but he is the only one who stands behind my right to feel that way!!!! A man of morals and integrity, who knows when the harddrive fails in your computer, you replace it, not drive yourself crazy spending needless time and hundreds (in this case TRILLIONS) of dollars trying to fix it!
He is against "Undeclared War" and for a strong "National Defense".... two horses of a different color! This (the war machine), and the amount of profits to large private corporations and Wall Street, has cause the mess we are in today. Wall Street and the bankers buying our leaders to keep the wars going. All the while the Central Banks keep printing more and more fiat currency, of no value, and laying the burden of the cost on the people, while they enjoy the fruits of vast profits, feeding the perpetual circle, until they hyper inflate the currency of our nation, causing the loss of our sovernty and our republic!
The list of wrongs, of criminal acts, and debauchery in government goes on and on!
IT IS TIME FOR CHANGE!
KNOW YOUR CANDIDATE, BEFORE YOU VOTE IN "MORE OF THE SAME" OR "THE LESSER OF TWO EVILS"!
RESTORE OUR REPUBLIC! POWER TO THE PEOPLE!
Again, this is jmo, with faith in all of us to do the right thing come election day, or before if needed.

The only problem remains that the media actually conceals Ron Paul in the background hiding him behind their propelled propaganda pushed candidates in the fore front....how many people voting notice the controlled propaganda to push the media sanctified candidates....

Chazster's photo
Thu 10/13/11 10:28 AM






Cain was explaining his 9-9-9 plan on some news program and while I'm listening to it I felt myself wanting to call him Herman Romney. This plan benefits big business and nothing else.

Lol totally untrue. I was paying over 23% taxes when I was working plus about 9% sales tax. So if I just started paying 13% more sales tax but paying 0 income I would have saved so much more money. Not to mention I am not taxed on what I don't spend. Also then they only tax your money once. Supposedly its illegal to tax the same money twice but they do it all the time now.


Cain first and foremost is a business man, if it is not a huge benefit for business he wouldn't be talking about it.


That is just a BS statement right there. That is like saying Obama is a black man so if it is not a huge benefit for black people he isn't for it. Businesses spend a lot of money. If sales tax is really high they will spend a lot of money on taxes paying for the supplies to create their products.

Chazster's photo
Thu 10/13/11 10:36 AM

In my own opinion...... (as I can only speak for myself)
Republicrats and the 2 party system, funded by Big Banks and Big Business (part of the reason for OWS), have been too long the deciding oligarchy of our nation and it's Republic. It turns my stomach to watch the debates and listen to the hype, knowing we are in for "more of the same" with the media sponsored, opinionated bias, and sell-out of the major networks (just more Big Business).
Obama is the perfect example of the hype. We wanted change, he gave it to us, by selling out America to the bankers (just read the resumes of his entire staff..... all Wall Streeters and bankers, the same people who gave us this mess!). He has accellerated our decline, and changed nothing but allow more power to the banks. Now he has taken a traitoristic office for the UN, which is strictly against the Constitution for any president to do. Worse than the puppet Bush, Obama has disregarded his obligations under the Constitution at every turn!
Romney, Santorum, Perry, Cain...... and a similar list on the "other" party side,........... you know the list........ all Millionaires! Lawyers, politicians, business owners and CEO's! How can we expect ANY of them to act on our behalf? The results? MORE OF THE SAME!
There is but ONE candidate who has NOT changed his views for public opinion, cares about personal liberties and freedom, and predicted as well as tried to prevent, for over 20 years, the events of today.... RON PAUL!
He does not subscribe to the lucretive retirement plan Congress voted for itself, he has constantly voted for disclosure, audit or abolishment of the Federal Reserve (a private banking cartel), and their power over the people by their enforcers.... the IRS! This is just to name a few of his many honorable traits. I don't agree with all his opinions or beliefs, but he is the only one who stands behind my right to feel that way!!!! A man of morals and integrity, who knows when the harddrive fails in your computer, you replace it, not drive yourself crazy spending needless time and hundreds (in this case TRILLIONS) of dollars trying to fix it!
He is against "Undeclared War" and for a strong "National Defense".... two horses of a different color! This (the war machine), and the amount of profits to large private corporations and Wall Street, has cause the mess we are in today. Wall Street and the bankers buying our leaders to keep the wars going. All the while the Central Banks keep printing more and more fiat currency, of no value, and laying the burden of the cost on the people, while they enjoy the fruits of vast profits, feeding the perpetual circle, until they hyper inflate the currency of our nation, causing the loss of our sovernty and our republic!
The list of wrongs, of criminal acts, and debauchery in government goes on and on!
IT IS TIME FOR CHANGE!
KNOW YOUR CANDIDATE, BEFORE YOU VOTE IN "MORE OF THE SAME" OR "THE LESSER OF TWO EVILS"!
RESTORE OUR REPUBLIC! POWER TO THE PEOPLE!
Again, this is jmo, with faith in all of us to do the right thing come election day, or before if needed.


Now I am a Ron Paul supporter. I wanted to vote for him last election but my county didn't have him on the ballet and they didn't have a write in option so it was just kind of an F-U type thing. Ron Paul just doesn't have the money to get past all the stonewalls he faces.

Another thing about this post. Even if Cain won the election there is no way his tax system would be implemented. 0% chance. America will never have a flat tax even though I think its a good idea. Probably would need to be closer to 12% but w/e it wont happen. Things pretty much don't happen in favor of the majority of the tax payers in this country. Sure people like to point out stuff favors Big Companies and the rich but they forget about all the stuff that supports the people at the bottom that don't pay taxes. Who supports all this? Middle class professionals. The people that have degrees that make decent money but are not rich. They have the highest tax burden IMO.