There has been much debate as to the context in which this book was written. Over the years, I've read just about everything the "experts" have to say...what do you say?

Who do you believe the "rose of Sharon and the lily of the valleys" was?

Do you believe it to be an alligorical depiction of GOD's love for Isreal? Or something more earthly and personal?

What is your personal feeling of this scripture?


My personal opinion is that this is not alligorical as many believe, but a poetic communication between Solomon and the Queen of Sheba...who I agree with some others to have probably been black.

Although twisted into an Alegorical Solomon was describing the real love of his life among all the women he had at his disposal. The Roman Catholic Church used any means to justify their beliefs (the rhetoric of St Thomas Aquinus for example) so yes this could be viewed as God's favoritism of Israel but first the Old Terstimate was the history of Judea which is one thing MOST Christians get wrong about it. Second was in the Old Testimate God Directly intervened with the affairs of man (Canceling Free Will!). Also the whole bible (The OLD TESTIMATE) clearly was full of God's favoritism of Israel. There are more than one reference to "God's Chosen."

I think the most classic line of the Song of Solomon was "Her belly is like a heap of wheat." What a thing to say about a woman but then again they liked them big in those days!

AndyBgood,

Thank you for the reply. I've met too many who don’t understand that the Od Testiment is in every aspect the Tanakh. Happy to know there are still some who get that.

What of the stanzas such as, “Let him kiss me with the kisses of his mouth…,” and, “As the apple tree among the apples…so is my beloved among the sons…” Do you think these are replies to his statements?
In fact "The Song Of Solomon" seems to me to begin with a message to Solomon.

Something that’s always been on my mind about the references to the “daughters of Jerusalem,” is that a great many of Solomon’s wives and concubines were foreign born women. I’m curious if you have any ideas on that?

You are referring to chapter 2. I just read it to refresh my memory of this passage. People foolishly assume that it is Solomon singing but it actually is Sharon's song to Solomon. Otherwise Solomon is having a homosexual affair which is not the case. "As the apple tree among the apples…so is my beloved among the sons…” Solomon is the Apple among apples, the son of sons, OF JUDEA! Actually I forgot that this was indeed an alegory to how a wife should love her husband and likewise how Christians should love the church. The whole thing is about Sharon's love for Solomon who was the King of Kings in his day. But in the church it also was a template of devotion. Notice how much of what it says sounds more like commandments? She was a Queen which Solomon had more than one. But Sharon also was dark skinned.

Reference Etheopian Jews, you will find that interresting.

But back to the Song of Solomon, notice how there is multiple references to "Ye Daughters of Jerusalam." Women held a lot of sway politically back in those days. Likewise I had forgotten this was written from a woman's perspective. I am sure it was an outline for the conduct of women for the day as well. Total devotion to your king (total devotion to your God/church!) The Song of Solomon is long winded but I am sure it is becasue of transaltion.


In Chapter 7 she self engrandizes herself.

Now the first five books of the bible were the Torah. The rest a conglomeration of historical documents (SUPPOSEDLY! The Catholic Church refuses some literature to be transcribed by modern scholars!)

Also bear in mind the number of Fertility references, remember God's command to the Jews leaving Egypt, "Go forth and multiply."

I've heard a similar take on this before…but not exactly. I'm going have to read it again with this in mind, which is fine as it's my favorite book. I’ve been convinced that this was a song taken from the correspondence between Solomon and the Queen of Sheba for a long time now. I do believe that the Queen of Sheba was black and was also the Queen of Ethiopia. I could not begin to tell you where I adopted this way of thinking, as I’ve thought it since grade school.

Jews in Ethiopia does not surprise me at all as I’m very interested in the Lemba tribe of Southern Africa who are thought by some to be the lost tribe of Israel. In fact recent DNA tests have confirmed the Y chromosome pattern of many of the Lemba people are the same patterns found in the Jewish priesthood…which proves without doubt their bloodlines came out of Israel, as their own oral history of their tribe and origins states. NOVA has done a documentary on the subject, which I am dying to see.

The Tanakh is the entire Jewish Bible compiled by the Jewish canon around 200 AD or later. It is made up of three parts, the Torah (the first 5 books), the Nevi’im (8 books of the 12 apostles) and the Ketuvim (all the remaining books and the 5 scrolls). Essentially, Tanakh was the name of the first Old Testament…the original

You know I have met Jews who don't really speak much of the Tanakh. They only revere the Torah. The Tanakh is not the only source of literature the church used to compile the bible from. Strangely thanks to Constantine Rome tried to absorb a Neo-Judaic cult of the time and make it a recognized religion.

Bear in mind Christians worship a Jewish Carpenter. Well, at least the ones who get it all wrong.

Something to keep in mind. Back in the days of Solomon being literate was rare. King Solomon was regarded historically as one of the greatest kings historically by MANY academicians. For someone to write something like this of a person was HUGE back in those days. It would have followed a person long after their death. Such was how legends were born of those days like the lost mines of King Solomon.

Jesus was MORE than a carpenter.

One surely hopes he was more than a carpenter.

Can't seem to find anything he actually built...

With the exception of that (two or more of them gathered)... Which requires not a building... Did he actually ever WORK as a carpenter?

The scholastic Rabbis in Jerusalem may be the only other people who have read it, but English versions are available too... not likely big sellers. The Torah is the teaching bible, so I guess that makes it the common scripture.

I’m a huge fan of Solomon. But his example got me into a lot of trouble when I was a child…I imagined by his example, that if you were wise enough, you could get away with just about anything, and everyone would still adore you. It turned out that God was apparently more forgiving than my parents, and I was mistaking high marks for wisdom. Haha!

He’s still my favorite King…so he’s still able to make it work for him.

It surprises me that more was not recored of his personal life.

Two theories there either his true life story has been hidden, OR he didn't exist at all.

Either way, doesn't speak well of the religion (s) if the most important character in the whole thing doesn't have much of a past to speak of.

It is a very beautiful part of the Bible. I do not think that there
is any reason to suppose that it was written to a specific person
and so that idea is presumptuous. That is, I think it is also unjustified
to think that it is from God to Israel.

I think it was intended merely for us to reflect on love and art as
they are gifts from God to all of us. It is a pleasure to read and
experience these beautiful and transcendent words and emotions. It is
appropriate to meditate on, pray and worship based on these emotions.

This prayer has been used for thousands of years as a meditation on
truth, beauty and holiness. It is unique and frequently read and it
should be.

What led me to believe that this is about an exchange between two people are the very specific physical descriptions of what seem like a very specific man and woman.

The woman is portrayed to be a black vineyard keeper, with black hair (compared to goats in the region), dark eyes and skin that are compared to caramel, with sheep white teeth. She is only one of his vast numbers of Queens, concubines and virgins, and was the daughter of a prince. She’s the only daughter of her mother as well as her mother’s favorite child. She is esteemed by all the daughters (I assume this refers to the daughters of Jerusalem, the term referred to with frequency) including the Queens. She is also referred to as his sister and spouse. I would assume sister to be some kind of term other than biological, but in those days one never knew. Solomon was thought to have lost some favor in the eyes of God for his choices in spouses and concubines.

He is portrayed as a white and ruddy man with red cheeks, raven dark eyes and black bushy hair. The whites of his eyes are compared to milk and his face and hands are referred to as golden, while his belly is compared to ivory. He is said to be the cheifest among 10,000 with many flocks. There are several references to Solomon…his chariot, bed and his men…which if not implying that he is her beloved, have been randomly inserted into the song for no apparent rhyme or reason. Therefore I believe the man written about is Solomon.

The reason I think of the woman as the Queen of Sheba, is because she considered to have been a major enough factor in Solomon’s live to have been featured in Kings…more so than any other wives or concubines. Whether it was Jeremiah, or an anonymous Deuteronomist…the writer seemed to considered her an important part of Solomon’s life. The Queen of Sheba was also to have been widely accepted as the Queen of Ethiopia as well, and is thought by many to have been black. Solomon was known to have favored black women. It is believed that Solomon converted the Queen of Sheba to the true faith, something he had failed to accomplish with his many foreign wives who clung to their false Gods. It’s my thinking that this alone would qualify her as his favorite of his “lilies”, though there is no proof that they were married, many suspect it, simply based on the great love and respect between them.

I think it is fine if you think that may be the motivation but I find nothing in the descriptions which would not be valid for a very wide portion certainly the vast majority of the population.

I find nothing in the verses to be specific enough to indicate individuality. Personally it is to me a poetic description of love
and the emotion of love and reflects generally on the holiness
and beauty of love in this life....

No matter how one looks at it, it's most certainly the most poetic model of love and devotion.