is it thought JA did not know the consequences of his deeds in advance?

at least he is willing to put his own life on the line, to expose corruption, more than can be said for all the arm chair commanders in chief, whom call for the death of many, with no regard nor care in the world for due process.

if due process is overrun in anyway, whom shall be next to be put to death by other's "feelings"?

for any society, that slowly and incrementally comes to wish to rule by it's feelings alone, having no regard for the sanctitiy of due process FOR ALL, has already come to cause the demise of itself, for mob mentality shall be envoked and embraced as justice, leaving not even a child a safe place to persue peaceful happiness.

Assange is a harmful dingdong and even his erstwhile supporters are
abandoning him due to his erratic and unconsionable behavior.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/24/world/24assange.html


Much has changed since 2006, when Mr. Assange, a 39-year-old Australian, used years of computer hacking and what friends call a near genius I.Q. to establish WikiLeaks, redefining whistle-blowing by gathering secrets in bulk, storing them beyond the reach of governments and others determined to retrieve them, then releasing them instantly, and globally.

Now it is not just governments that denounce him: some of his own comrades are abandoning him for what they see as erratic and imperious behavior, and a nearly delusional grandeur unmatched by an awareness that the digital secrets he reveals can have a price in flesh and blood.

Several WikiLeaks colleagues say he alone decided to release the Afghan documents without removing the names of Afghan intelligence sources for NATO troops. “We were very, very upset with that, and with the way he spoke about it afterwards,” said Birgitta Jonsdottir, a core WikiLeaks volunteer and a member of Iceland’s Parliament.

Well said. All these rabid american firsters havent a clue to what america is supposed to be about. We are wiretapped water boarded and lied to by our corrupt government. We slaughter innocents daily in countries we attack and invade for no real reasone at all. They get all worked up over a man that exposes the corruption but ignore the actual corruption. We are a nation of rubes.

Actually the U.S. is one of the best countries in the world in
routing out corruption. We have a free press and freedom of speech
and a decent judiciary and military protocol.

If you want to go after corruption, go after the countries which
do not have these safeguards and movements like the radical Islamic
terrorists who actually try to terrorize and kill people on purpose.

WOW this is a great read.

"Once again, the curtain of secrecy is drawn back and Olympus looks more like Oz. The machinations of empire turn out to be banal and ordinary.

In a time of endless war, when democracy is an orchestrated charade and citizen engagement is less welcome in the corridors of power than it has ever been, when the traditional checks and balances of government are in unchallenged collusion with one another, when the media act not as watchdogs of democracy but guard dogs of the interests and clichés of the status quo . . . we have WikiLeaks, disrupting the game of national security, ringing its bell, changing the rules."


http://www.commondreams.org/view/2010/12/02-0

Not a big Ron Paul fan but this makes sence

"In a free society we're supposed to know the truth,""In a society where truth becomes treason, then we're in big trouble. "

Ron Paul defending Wikileaks in an interview with Fox News.
http://www.allvoices.com/contributed-news/7518099-ron-paul-defends-julian-assange

This is not a case of truth=treason though. This is a case of US
diplomats and military being denied the crucial ability to have
private conversations within the diplomatic corps or within the
military chain of command.

Obviously Asssange/Wikileaks is interfering with the US ability to
assure privacy of their communications as a traitor to the US and
will be held accountable and punished severely for their actions.

Privacy and trust are often needed in diplomatic and military
communications to prevent harm to troops and diplomatic efforts.

Ron Paul would likely not disagree.

As in most things what you think and the reality are two differant things. If you took the time to follow the link of the Ron Paul interview you would see that in fact he does disagree.

Ron Paul is a loon.

Ron Paul is a loon.

All I can tell you is that Wikileaks would not have hit mainstream media, and it would have been shut down by the NSA immediately after the documents were released--that is, if they were really intended to remain top-secret. This was planned in order to get a chaotic, anarchist, and violent response from the people of this country. If you don't think that this was pre-planned, you still have much research ahead of you. For example, look at what our Jesuit elite have planned for us...
Project Blue Beam Documentation-
http://educate-yourself.org/cn/projectbluebeam25jul05.shtml

There will indeed be a show in the sky, and you will see "Jesus" in your brain being projected electromagnetically with sophisticated HAARP technology.

Video Project Blue Beam pt1- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QllPJ1UjAjI

Video Project Blue Beam pt2- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghSaB0ayCvo

It's called Problem, Reaction, Solution.
1. Problem: The government Elite create a problem(Global Chaos and UFO's)

2. Reaction: The people have a scared reaction("Help us world leaders, oh NO!!! My family! We'll do anything!!! We'll give up our rights!!! Just help us!!!)

3. Solution: "OK! We will help on the condition that you accept the New World Order and forget about the constitution"

I really hope you guys are prepared. Stop competing over who has the best argument, and face the facts. Wikileaks is all part of the plan to make you become a chaotic people with violent reactions, so you will become the problem, and the "aliens and NWO" will become the solution. Investigate. This, I am afraid to say, is the truth.

If you think I'm crazy, then look at the links I provided you... Don't take it from me... Do your own research. Be your own investigator and quit relying on fake-media like Fox News and CNN.

Love,
Ryan

You are simply wrong about that.

I read your link and it does not address the issue of whether
Paul believes that the US military and diplomatic corps deserves
to have a right to private communications but of course they
do.

To all the people who support that criminal enterprise wikileaks.

HeavenlyB and Bestin,

I don't entirely agree with you on this issue, but I am happy that there are people like you - and Assange - in the world with opinions that temper the evil of the massive power structures (like nations and their military) that shape our world.



I have to agree. Wikileaks is an amazing and beneficial website, but I think they went too far on this one.

Edit: Or someone went to far - perhaps that simply Assange himself.







Ah, I see now. Not it all makes perfect sense.




More spam.

'One of the best', sure, but thats setting the bar very low. That corruption is the norm does make it okay.



No, if you want to go after corruption, go after whatever form appeals to you to go after - we need to work on all fronts, everywhere. Trying to say one ought *not* to criticize US corruption because someone else is worse suggests a kind of endorsement of US corruption.

1. One of the best is not too low a bar - most other parts of
the world have no freedom of speech or freedom of the press for
example. Of course it can be improved and should be. Nobody's
perfect.

2. If you want to fix a problem (corruption) it is always preferable
to attack the most serious source of the problem first. That does
not mean that you ignore the minor problems and I did not suggest
that.

It does mean that you should go after the more serious issues
such as terrorism first.

It is like a plumber trying to fix multiple leaks in a pipe who
is fixing a pinhole at one part of the pipe while there is a gaping
5" gusher at another spot on the pipe. Fix the big problems first
and then address the minor issues to minimize the effect of the
multiple problems. In the case at hand, you have agreed that the
U.S. has one of the best systems in the world of self-regulating
corruption thus it is a minor issue in the U.S. So, put on your
plumber gear and go after those corrupt and miscreant organizations
and govts. like Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran, N. Korea, Syria, Al-Qaeda
etc. which are rife with corruption and have no self-regulation whatsoever
as a priority because it is a more serious and immediate problem
because they are mass murdering people with impunity.

Since you say that "of course it can be improved and should be", then you agree with me that being 'one of the best' is not good enough.

It is always morally suspect to decide 'what you find acceptable' by comparing an entity's behavior to the behavior of the rest in its category.

He's one of the nicest serial killers..... he's not that bad as pedophiles go.... that regime's approach to genocide was relatively humane...



This would make sense if you were the only person acting to solve the problem. This line of thinking breaks down when you have multiple originally disconnected parties who are potential actors to solve the many problems. If it were possible to coordinate the activities of all those parties (it isn't), then a more intelligent solution would work on all problems simultaneous - allocating your resources accordingly. Lacking the ability to coordinate the actions of a billion potential actors, it is still preferable to have a distributed and simultaneous approach. In that case, telling people they ought NOT to solve some part of a problem, because another problem is greater, is inefficient.


There are a few other facts to consider here: wrongdoing breeds wrongdoing. Keeping your house in order is tremendously helpful in trying to improve places far away from you. If you don't address the corruption in your own government first, you lose credibility and trust amongst people you might influence far away. I'm stating that as a fact about 'cause and effect', not as a suggestion that we ought to address US corruption before any other kind of corruption - that would be stupid when we can allow different parties to act simultaneously.



Your example illustrates the flaw in your thinking which I mentioned above - there is not only one plumber, nor one team of people who must (or even can) be coordinated as one group.

The situation is not at all like the plumber situation you describe. Its more like a person who is fixing the smaller cracks in the levee right outside their house, rather than leaving those cracks to worsen while they go 10 miles upriver to help a team of people working to repair a much greater crack in the same levee system. Both problems ought to be fixed; both problems can be addressed simultaneously. Your view of which problem is more important may depend on where you live.

But this brings us to another part of this equation - when you are dealing with a large number of distributed people, allowing them to work according to their motivating opinionatedness gives you tremendous gains in their work efforts. If someone cares about some part of the problem more than another, its counter-productive for you to tell them they ought not to work to address it (or even criticize the causes), simply because you (reasonably) believe that another part of the problem is more important.



This is another place I completely disagree with you. I agreed with the fact of the comparison, but not with the overall evaluation nor with the basic idea of arriving at an overall evaluation based on comparison. I think that is morally wrong, in fact. If your neighbor is eating babies, that doesn't make it less wrong for you to be torturing people.




And here we have your agenda, your worldview, your priorities. I could be short-sighted and tell you not to go after them, because its more effective to clean your own house first. (Jesus even told us to do so). But I won't - I think you should follow your passion, and do what you can to help make the world a better place, whereever you see fit.

to compare oneself to the worst, is simply a self justification, but rather to compare oneself to perfect, allow one to set the bar itself.

but then what actually wishes to set the bar for itself TOO HIGH, lol...

but in a world, where the grandest excuse of ignorance and lack of caring, is "no one is perfect" is used, and totally embraced, what could be expected.

of course, total self delusions...

self is the best, in and about what it declares and thinks about itself, and this mentality is applied to whomever self happens to think if sexy, or cute, or handsome in politics, lol...

a dumbed down humanity of self declared experts, that make assertions as facts, like kindergarten children pretending to be great...

if one thinks of itself as honest, sweet, cool, awesome, smart, a leader, it is certainly true, and no amount of words as feedback from what does not agree can convince otherwise...

it's like a fairy tale land, where self can be whatever it thinks it is, and needs no solid proof of anything to establish such as fact...

hell, a narcissist man can tell a women she is awesome, and she believes it, because that what she wants to think...

and a women can tell a man he is awesome, and he believes it, because thats what he first wanted to prove to himself...

and we wonder why politics, the game of playing with human lives, is crumbling...

it only takes a little flattery, to convince the delusional they are awesome, awesome enough that their singular self actually knows the solutions to a world run amock with self validation...

if it was actually believed in total essence, that "no human is perfect", there would be no malice and hate in the world over who does not treat self with kit gloves.

but, since no one is perfect, make everything ok, and compare it to the worst case scenario, to live in the dream state of everything is just going to turn out ok, since it always does...

what a ****in delusoinal statement to begin with.

the problem seems to be most, the mass majority all endorse the grand excuse of "no one is perfect", but for themself most, and to suite and shield oneself from any true accountability of how one's actions shall effect many others...

so, these that could give a **** less, about anything but their own singular happiness most, and of course, MAYBE ANOTHER THAT MAKES THEM HAPPY, ALWAYS COMPARE TO THE WORST, to crutch up their delusions of reality...

a great excuse for oneself, and for whomever self wishes, if and when it wishes to aplly it, or turn a blind eye to corruption...

anything that suggests corruption is not a devasting blow to the health and welfare and freedom and liberty of all equally, is simply corrupt itself.

but, then we live in a world where what thinks itself awesome, actually embraces singular and self agenda and self attainment as good, with no regard for any negative effect on children, spouse, family members, or others in society.

who would have thought, an excuse such as no one is perfect, could reduce and lead an entire society and world to the unsanity run amock of self validation, but embraced as individuality...

**** individuality, if it dosen't give a **** about what destroys a peaceful place for all to live in peacefully.

corruption is a disease that implodes a society from within, leaving it totally vulnerable to it's enemies.

Something nudges me inside and tells me that you are a troll.

Here is the definition of a troll from Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29

"In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into a desired emotional response[1] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion."

How this pertains to you:
1. your message was off-topic.
2. Saying "More spam" instead of researching more into the topic at-hand was obviously used to provoke a desired emotional response in order to disrupt the normal on-topic discussion.

I highly recommend focusing on the relevance of the information I provided in my last post. The truth is that government pays trolls full time to affect public consciousness. I accuse this poster of being a troll. My information is well-researched, and the only thing you can say is, "More Spam." I've been dealing with you knuckleheads for 3 years now, and your attitudes are all the same. Saying "More Spam" was an obvious attack on my credibility. Anyone that thinks I am not credible for information can visit my youtube channel. www.youtube.com/smpwast3d

Love,
Ryan

"We are all one, so stop fighting your selves."

Research NASA's Project Blue Beam

It's real, and it's THE PLAN