Hey guyz, just a quick question, have any of you looked into the mathimatical probability of life arising from non-life? Apparently the chance of a single cell coming together by natural process's is 10 to the power of 40,000, and since mathimatic's say's anything as high as or higher than 10 to the power of 50 is impossible(never happen's) wouldnt that by logic mean that to believe in evolution is to trust that theory over mathimatic's? Wouldnt that move evolution out of the realm of science into the realm of faith?If math's make's evoltionary origin's impossible would you move from athiest to agnostic?Just curious, peace:)


Btw I have given only one example for simplification, for those interested check out "chance's of life in our universe" and "mathimatic's disprove evolution?" on youtube, interesting watch, cya's.

It all comes down to Murphy's law

The chances being displayed here are based upon what standard? If the probabilities for life to evolve from inanimate objects that you speak of are, in fact, accurate - what is the probability for a 'God' to come into existence?

If God was to come into existance the same probability's would apply, but in most deist religion's God is eternal, regardless I was commenting on this flaw in evolution in this area because i find it interesting, it may not prove God, but it could very well disprove evolution, peace:)

The general theory of evolution is well understood regarding small mutations to adapt to better breeding conditions. The beginnings of evolution are still guesses. The main theory is that life came from Earth's oceans in the sunlight. A newer theory is that the chemical process in black smokers actually provided a consist chemical "soup" which can be observed today and gives a more likely scenario at to the origin of life on Earth. Another theory is that Mars, which was smaller and cooler faster, created life first and meteorites brought the first building blocks (or life itself) to Earth.

With that much ambiguity, the math of the probabilities is meaningless. If life did evolve independently on Mars, the chances are life will evolve everywhere it gets a chance.

Black Smoker Chemistry

Thanx bro, but these thing's are taken into account in the mathimatic's they used such example's for the equation, also moving the problem to Mar's would just be moving the problem, the mathmatition's wherent ignorant of the theory of evolution in origin's, this is what imo make's the number's meaningful rather than meaningless, but of course we are all free to believe as we please.If nothing else it make's for interesting conversation imo:) peace.

Who are these mathematicians?

I'm completely confused by the idea that a certain number is too large to reach and therefore discredited for any purpose of evaluation. Pick a number. Any number. Add 1. Numbers are infinite.

Is this thread actually meant to be a question of science or is a question of religion/faith?

Because mankind as a whole can not completely understand a concept does not mean that the concept is invalid.

If you cram all the possible elements together life WILL come about...

Elements will combine over time. Each set of elements that combine to form a viable, more complex element will set in motion the next step.

Given enough time those 'more complex' elements will mix and remix until a viable new complex element is formed.

I have yet to see anyone actually measure time accurately. Our concept of time is based upon our limit of vision. We can see (by our tools) what we think is the edge of the universe. We can see (again by our tools) what we think is the smallest 'elements'. Yet each time we 'advance' our tools we see that the previous limit was not the 'edge' but simply a limit we learned to see beyond.

Argueing about what is real is sorta like a color blind person attempting to describe 'red' to one that can see the difference.

There are actually a lot of episodes on mingle that fit that bill. There are people who know nothing of many topics who explain those topics to folks who have studied and worked with them their entire lives.

Good analogy.

The laws of thermodynamics seem to disprove it. for a summary- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_of_thermodynamics

The laws of thermodynamics do not, in any way, "seem to disprove it". That reference is basic and does not even reference such disproof.

I had a similar thought while reading this. These are the lengths people will go to in order to justify their beliefs.



Thats a good question.



Quoted for truth. HeavenlyBoy, you've picked up on - and now tried to propagate - a completely false and (if examined closely) foolish idea. Its one of the most ridiculous anti-evolution arguments that exist. The laws are precise statements which actually play a role in motivating evolution, but nothing about the theory of evolution contradicts the laws of thermodynamics.

If you want to investigate this more thoroughly (and honestly), remember that proper application of the laws of thermodynamics requires paying careful attention to details.

I am no scholar but the OP doesn't make sense anyway. Where do the origins of the math used come from? Whose theory is it? And what was the theory used for?

Ma thematic theories are just theories also.

Such as the difference between open and closed systems, such as the transfer of energy, and the production of heat as waste energy.

The fact that gravity produces huge amounts of energy, that fusion from the sun through our atmosphere has a net gain of total energy.

That organic chemistry as it meets structural selection is plenty of an impetus for the chaining of larger molecules with ever advancing functionality.

For a proper mathematical equation to be created that could accurately represent the probability of an as yet unknown process is absurd.

To believe that it could . . .

The law of thermo prove's as far as i know that the universe as we know it cannot be eternal, though it would be interesting to see what the argument behind his comment is, oh btw someone posted that they couldnt understand how something could be mathimatically impossible, it is not that it is impossible, but it is so improbable once the numbers reach 10 to the power of 50 that math's consider's it something that never happen's, the number's become so vast.

suerly if something has a probability, then its not impossible, just a varying degree of unlikely??

i personally find that when i think of the begining of time, i get a headache, feel sick and turn to drink.


just be carefull people, alchahol is a slippery slope

They are not based on mathimatical theory's but equations, lol, i didnt realise evolutionist's would be so militant in this forum, now I know many arnt open to discuss any challenge to evolution I'll try to hold my tongue:) Oh and please dont be mistaken, everything I have posted is intelligible and coherent, thanx:)

25 posts, i`ll let you in on something

no one realy means to come across as disscredating your question, some will agree some wont. we just express our opinions as strongly as we belive them.

i thought it was a good thread

now, wheres my alchahol

I ran away with it!



Itsnolongeri, try renting the last two hours of Carl Sagan's Cosmos. He does a nice job of it breaking down, including the probability of intelligent life on other planets.

Heavenly, Wiki is not the best to use for proving or disproving. Anything can be made up and put on it. Professors don't allow it for research papers. And with as much silly stuff as I've seen, it's an automatic disqual for me too!