Jerry, I too am shying away from connecting the government to complicity
with Sept 11.

I think Sept 11 happened for several understandable reasons, but that
the neocons, already seized with their agenda to 'protect' Israel, used
Sept 11 to panic the American people and their President into carrying
out as much of their agenda as possible.

Virutally everything I described int he posts above comes from now open
sources. The Democrats don't make a big deal of it because they too have
their own neocon problem: Indyk and Ross, for example were in senior
positions under Clinton. Most poltiicians, republican or democrat, are
still reluctant to confront AIPAC (the Israeli lobby) or the fact that
Israel is now viewed as among the top three intelligence threats to the
US. A few politicians have, and they have immediately been targetted by
AIPAC. A few academics, like Norman Finkelsetin, have taken on AIPAC,
and have as a result been hounded by pro-Israeli contributors to their
instituions, including being denied tenure.

It is not a thing of which we can be proud.

Oceans

Let me put it this way.

Somebody is making big money with the sale of all the weapons and the
ammunition that is used in this war, so this somebody must have a great
interest in keeping the war going.

Public sources on the Bush administration and the runup and handling of
Iraq. I am doing these from memory so spelling may be off.

David Isikoff, HUBRIS
Tom Ricks, CHAOS
Michael Gordon and Bernard Trainor, COBRA II
Bob Woodward, STATE OF DENIAL
Rob Schultheis, WAGING PEACE
Bob Baer, SEE NO EVIL
Anonymous (Mark Scheur), IMPERIAL HUBRIS

A lot more are available and worth reading. These are just the ones
that come to mind quickly.

Let me know if you want more.



Oceans

Excuse me, it isn't CHAOS.

Tom Ricks, FIASCO

Seymour Hersh, CHAIN OF COMMAND

And then there is George Tenet's benighted but revealing book CENTER OF
THE STORM. I haven't finished reading this one, but so far I would say
it is worth the read.

Oceans

Oceans, It's OK, I don't need the flowers.

I am in the midst of Cobra II. Thus far I see it as biased but
interesting.

Invisible, I understand what you're saying about money and weapons, and
equipment. Very tangled web..

See you guys later

I am very interested in your take on Cobra II. You've got the background
to assess it.


Oceans

Oceans, You got it, as soon as I finish it. May take a a few days
given my schedule right now but I will definately get back to you on it.
Cheers

YEP....BUSH IS A JERK!... I SAID THAT ALL ALONG.

From what Ive read Bush was advised by almost every military expert in
the Pentagon, past and present, that containment was working and did not
need to invade. He decided not to listen and Cheney is implicated
directly in covering up the CIA intel. They even went as far as blocking
key CIA personnel from attending briefings on the matter. I have read
some of the testimonies from COBRA personnel during congressional
hearings and the only bias I see is that once again they were ignored,
and their testomonies completely left out of the first 9/11 official
reports. This seemes suspicious to me and many others!

IF PEOPLE HAVENT GOT THE MESSAGE BY NOW THAT BUSH IS A CON AND A
FAKE....THEY NEVER WILL!!

Geeeeeez ...I was there in the late 70's and 80's when saddam gassed the
Iranians...1000's...if that isn't WMD I don't know what is!....women
...children!....Cheney is the manipulator...who....led the
deception....he created is own info team...and wouldn't rely on what was
in place in the region already!