The question of conciousness is relevant when we consider whether or not and how the unconcious effects the concious, for instance the processes of our brains give rise to conciousness, that we are unaware of, called the subconcious. The concious sends feed back(sends back what we experience) back to the subconcious level where upon a new form of conciousness is created; is it a fair assumption that the conciouness we experience can not be verified if this is true? Are we aware of the feedback of our concious mind and its effect on the subconcious? That would be a contradiction in terms. Therefore conciousness from an introspective position can never be understood and as we are all different any interpretation would be governed by the experience of another in the same predicamint who may not exactly, who does not at all share your particular experiences. I suppose descartes' demon lives in all of us.

Di...



This definition I like, however it seems to me that it cannot be fulfilled without a subject which is self-aware. To be aware of one's own thoughts and feelings is to be self-aware, is it not? I think we actually agree here.



Can thoughts be clear and organized without the subject being aware of them, or would that only constitute instinct/unconscious response?

Billy...

There is a distinction to be made between awareness and self-awareness, however, to be blunt, I am having difficulty finding a construct which effectively finds self-awareness as a constituent of consciousness, or vice-versa...

Voile...

After re-reading your post, I must apologize! That pesky personal truth of mine placed blinders on actuality. Although, I would like to see your thoughts in a more directed manner. Would it be accurate for me to say that you have little to no use for the term?

That is the position that I have come to, actually. It would be more along the lines of my current thinking if I were to say that the term consciousness equates to self-awareness in my perspective.

After re-reading your responses in the GR "reality" thread, I come away once again with a metaphysical feeling. To ascribe mysterious elements to the reptilian(stem) part of our triune brain is actually calling it as it is... Those processed bits which are completely unconscious pieces of information at birth must have a source, no? It is more than obvious that we are not a blank slate when born.

You may find the "evolution is it fact" thread of interest, I posted a link to a speaker which was quite informative, thought provoking, and humorous as well...

I have heard the term "conscious" used in the way that Creative is describing, having to do with self awareness or self reflection by a man wrote a book and he said that human kind only recently became conscious.

He said that if you look at how ancient scripture was written in the form of stories, they were simple and one dimensional and not reflective of any thoughts or opinions, and that people 2000 years ago were not conscious in the sense that they thought about thinking or being self aware. They simply reacted to external events and stimuli in a semi-conscious or unconscious manner, letting their emotions guide them.

He points out a time after the dark ages when the writing started showing signs of reflection and opinions and states that man kind was beginning to become conscious.

But I would not agree that they were completely unconscious but that they had a degree of consciousness somewhat less than we have today. It is as if they were just waking up to self.

I look back on my thinking and my awareness when I was a teen ager, and think that I was unconscious then. I have felt myself become more aware as the years pass, and it is like we are collecting information and becoming more and more conscious as we gain experience.

So I still believe that consciousness and the amount we have comes in quantum units or degrees according to the information and experience we collect and store within our higher mind.

It is like waking up from a deep sleep you can feel yourself becoming more conscious until you are awake.

But even wide awake we may not be fully conscious. We could be in a room of people and we are not aware of their energy, intentions or thoughts. We are unconscious (unaware) of that information.

But lets say we evolved into empaths were we suddenly could feel the energy in the room and know the thoughts of the others. Then we might feel that we are still waking up and becoming more conscious.

So consciousness starts from almost zero... to infinity depending on how much the vessel (thinking center or unit) has collected.

JB