WHO ARE THESE IDIOTS WHO CAME TO THIS EARTH JUST ABOUT THE SAME TIME AS
ALL OF US DID AND AT THE SAME ERA....AND SAY THAT ROCK IS A BILLION
YEARS OLD!!....WHERE DOES HE GET HIS AMAZING KNOWLEDGE OF SUCH FACTS
KNOWN TO HIM?.....YOU CANNOT TELL ME AN AGE OF SOMETHIN YOU DIDNT SEE
THROUGH TIME OR CHANGE YOURSELF....IT AMAZES ME HOW MUCH POTENTIAL THESE
IDIOTS HAVE BUT CHOOSE TO BELIEVE IN FAIRY TALES....AND GEOLOGY STARTED
FROM THE MIAN IDIOT MAYBE A (CAVEMAN) lolz...WHO WAS WALKING IN A DESERT
KICKING ROCKS....AND DECIDED TO PUT A DATE ON IT....THEN FROM HIS THEORY
LED EVERYBODY ELSE'S.....ITS JUST MIND BOGGLING HOW YOU CAN ASSUME AN
AGE OF SOMETHING YOU PICK UP FROM THE EARTH...HEY PEOPLE....WHY NOT READ
THE BIBLE....Y'ALL SCIENTIST ALWAYS TRYIN TO PROVE THE BIBLE
WRONG....AND YOU ALL HAVE YET TO DO SO...AND FOR ALL YOU NERDS OUT THERE
STILL SCRATCHIN YUH HEAD AS TO WHY THERE ARE SHELLFISH ON TOP OF
MOUNTAINS....ITS BECAUSE GOD FLOODED THE DAMN EARTH...AND THAT RIGHT
THERE PROVES IT....STOP TRYIN TO FIND ANSWERES THATS ALREADY IN FRONT OF
YOU.....AND FOR ALL OF YOU WHO BELIEVE IN DARWIN....IF WE REALLY DID
COME FROM APES OR MONKEYS.....WHY ARE MONKEYS AND APES STILL IN
EXITENCE?....THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN EXTINCT BECAUSE WE EVOLVED FROM
THEM....DONT YOU THINK?....AND YOU DUMBAZZ SCIENTIST YOU KNOW THAT WHEN
SOMETHING EVOLVES THE OLD IS NO MORE...AND IT STEPS INTO THE NEW....TELL
ME WHY MONKEYS AND APES STILL EXIST TODAY?......TAKE YOUR DEGREE AND
PAWN IT!...CUZ Y'ALL WAISTIN YUH TIME TRYIN TO FIND ANSWERS IN THE
STONEAGE..I MEAN SERIOUSLY Y'ALL COULD SPEND MILLIONS TO FIND AN ANSWER
AS TO WHY A BUTTERFLY IS FREAKIN GREEN!!...GET REAL......
SINCERELY,
A MAN WHO BELIVES N GODZ WORD.....

I wasn't there to see the temple of Notre Dame Built, but I know it's
hundreds of years old. I wasn't there for the Birth of the forest near
where I live yet know it's at the least 600 years old. Just because you
weren't there to see it doesn't mean it didn't exist before you were
born.

can you tell me when rock was born?

and it is by history you know whne it was built...before all that we had
nothing...so no one can say exactly when...and has for trees? yes you
can probably know their age...only because people then did have
knowledge and wrote it down in the books as to thier nature of their
growth....

This should answer your questions....

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-age-of-earth.html

Various rocks can be dated according to the type of rock they are are.
For instance where I live there is igneous rock, volcanic, yet Mt. Royal
has not been active for centuries. In fact it is classed as a dead
volcano as are several others in the area. Areas with sedimentary rocks,
sandstone for instance, it takes centuries of pressure to form sand into
stone. In areas with metamorphic stone, marble, it again takes centuries
of heat/pressure to form them. The age can be determined from trace
elements, which alter or disappear at known rates or from fossilized
material in them. The process of fossilization itself taking centuries.

still dont believe it....still talkin bout rock millions of years
old....they may say....oh we know that because the layers from
volcanoes....then can they answer how many volcanoes erupted to get all
those layers of rock?.....i would love to know...since they know rocks
are around the million of years of age......because god knows it could
have been just one volcano that erupted a couple of thousand years
ago...since they know rocks are around the million of years of age......

Fortunately, reality isn't dependent on any one person's belief or lack
thereof. Reality is what it is, regardless of who agrees with it.
There are still people around who believe the sun orbits the earth, or
that television is impossible.

just as i can easily say there is no right from wrong....a person can
shoot another man and say he was right for doin it....while another is
in disagreement with the whole situation.....

im not violent people...just writin here.......

We have a chain of mountains here we call them the Laurentians. Granted
they are not all dead volcanoes but a large number are. I don't
understand the comment about one volcano starting everything though.
Volcanoes are the natural vents of the Earth and there are still many
around the Earth that are active, many that are dormant (haven't
eurupted in centuries) and which suddenly eurupt from the prssure under
them ie: Mt. St. Helen's. New one's are also forming continuously. A
lesser form of volcanic activity would be hot springs / geysers ie:
Yellowstone National Park. To have faith in one's beliefs is commendable
but so is the realization that the Earth has been here for a long time
no matter how/why it formed.

Exactly, everybody is entitled to their own opinion. Me, I prefer to
base mine on mounds and mounds of scientific evidence, not on ancient
superstition, but it's all good.

But I like ancient Superstition Lex, It's one of my fields of study!He
Karma thanks for bailing me out with tons of info.

Dane, I like studying that stuff, too, mythology, all of it. But I
don't look to it for explanations about the way the world runs, etc. --
I don't think the earth sits on top of an endless stack of turtles, and
I don't believe the sun is Apollo in his chariot racing across the sky.
It's fun to see what kinds of things people believed way back in the old
days, before we had science and medicine and astronomy and biology and
climatology and stuff. But I wonder about people who still believe that
stuff is real, in light of the state of current scientific formulations!
You can enjoy a Superman comic book without actually believing he's
going to break through your wall.

Yeah, the scientific basis,should definately be your Starting point.I
don't believe the first beings were licked from the Ice by a great cow
either.I'm just trying to have some fun with the Grumbly lion.

There was this tree in the very early Norse mythology, it had a name
like Yggadrasil or Clearasil or something....I forget now --

I actually met an Odinist once, the guy actually worships Odin -- I
figure, well, really, how is that so different from worshipping anything
else....?

Like Bart Simpson said, "Thank goodness we've come to our senses and now
we worship a carpenter who lived 2000 years ago!"

I am one of those "young Earth nuts". Fact of the matter is that there
is no way to "date" rocks. RadioCarbon dating works only on on something
made with carbon. Fossils, are chemically, rocks.

How then do we say that a fossil is "3million years old" ? By the
surrounding rock structure, and make an assumption that the deeper the
strata, the older the bones... but, of course, the fossils are found -
on the surface. Sigh. So much for consistency.

It takes just as much "faith" to accept the crazy, un-measurable, idea
that a stone is 4 million years old. Why? Because someone said so, and
has no objective way to back it up. Might as well say the rock is a
fossilized turd of St Peter, or Krishna, or whatever-god-you-want. Its
all equally valid.

If this sounds like I am making fun of you, I apologize in advance.....

You are entitled to believe in any old fantasy you wish, HOWEVER..... Do
you dispute the fact that a tree's age can be determined by counting the
rings when you cross-section it? Do you think that dinosaur fossils are
fakes? You can honestly say that literally millions of bones of these
giant creatures are nothing more than the creation of some who would
choose to fool people the world over? How do you think paleontologists
are able to estimate the age of these fossils? Look up "carbon-dating".
It's a scientifically accurate way of determining the age of something.
There are trapped gases, minerals, elements in rock, dirt, dinosaur
bones, etc. that can be put through carbon dating to estimate the age of
an object to within literally a few years.

This is not dogma, not indoctrination, not doctrine. This is fact. Its
similar in idea to counting thos rings on that tree to determine that it
is 30 years old. Of course, you could stand around and spend 30 years
watching it grow so you could have your imperical proof...

The evolution of something does NOT mean that the old becomes extinct...
It is a new branch DESCENDED from an EXISTING one. Want proof? Surely
you have heard of a breed of dog known as a ****apoo. It is a breed unto
its own; blueblood, purebred. Know why it's called a ****apoo? Because a
long, long time ago a ****er Spaniel got together with a Poodle and did
the funky monkey.... Now, years later their grandkids are known as an
individual breed, rather than a hybrid of two separate breeds.... Yet
****er Spaniels and Poodles are still around. The ****apoo is an
evolutionary result of the canine. As to why the freaking butterfly is
green... It happens to be an evolutionary product rising out of the need
for camoflage against its enemies hunting it for food....

Of course, you can just believe that "the word of god" came from your
god because you have been told that by men who have been told that by
other men who have been told that by other men who wrote it down and
said that god told them, instead of understanding that "the word" came
from those in power who wanted more power -- total power...

Hey, of course, that's my opinion. You have your opinion. Opinions are
like a-holes: Everyone has one, and they all smell like sh!t. Of course,
my opinions happen to be backed up by scientifically proven fact.

Mr Kat,

No, you assumed too much from my posting (or did you mean Island's
Original post?). I was suprised at how strongly worded your reply was.
Anyway, you asked specific questions:

1. Dispute the fact that a tree's age can be determined by counting the
rings when you cross-section it?

..No. Radio carbon dating etc has a rational, objective principle

2. Dino bones faked?
..Ha ha. No I do not. Of course, there are no 100% full dino skeletons.

3. are nothing more than the creation of some who would
choose to fool people the world over...?

..Slow down there. I didnt suggest anything of the sort.

4. "that can be put through carbon dating to date.."

..No. You are mistaken. Only once-living things can be radio-dated.
Fossils are chemically stone - they cannot be radio dated. That is a
serious fault in the theory.

5. "This is not dogma, not indoctrination, not doctrine. This is fact."

..Actually, your style and intensity accurately depict the definition of
'dogma', 'indoctrination' and 'doctrine'.

6. "The evolution of something does NOT mean that the old becomes
extinct.."

..See, here we completely agree. Theory of Evolution/Natural Selection
is an observable, measurable, demonstratable reality. Just as you
pointed out. You can even suggest that the theory might explain the
current status of all beings. Maybe. There's no conclusive fact simply
because there is no objective measurement of the past.


7. "...word of god..."

...So it comes down to this? I wasnt suggesting that, but, since you
brought it up, lets discuss. Fact is, that you can find 3000+ years of
character-by-character validation of the text of the Old Testament
within 98% at a char-by-char level. In contrast, you are speaking with
dogmatic intensity that you are absolutely sure that the earth is
millions of years old, and you base this "faith" on a theory that isnt
even 100yrs old. In fact, your "faith" theory has permutated several
times in the last 50yrs. Each new generation wants to slide the scales
of "how old things really are" - and each generation manufactures its
own scientific "scripture" to support the new dogma. Sigh.

Same sh1t, different crowd. I'm comfortable with a tradition thats
remained consistent for 3000+ years, as fanicful as it may seem, and
I'll just laugh at how secularists stab each other endlessly about who
has the latest "scientific scripture" to uphold.

Yeah..., Mike, that wasnt aimed at your post... LOL.

Not menaing to come off as a wiser than thou type. BUT... Carbon dating
can accurately be done on fossils and on rock as well, since you can,
will, and do find organic elements trapped in rock. My point is that
it's my belief that religion and belief in god is just as biased and
slanted and based on opinion as belief in anything else. Those of you
who do believe in a Supreme Being are welcome to that belief. I just
wish that those of you who seem fanatical about it offer those of us who
are not into that the same courtesy. If I am correct, all religion
teaches tolerance of others. I find a lot of religious people overlook
this one tenet. I believe that not only should people have freedom of
religion, but they should have the choice of freedom FROM religion if
that is their choice...